1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby SOLSAKS » Tue Oct 14, 2014 9:31 pm

more recent photos.
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby SOLSAKS » Tue Oct 14, 2014 9:33 pm

front suspension.
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby SOLSAKS » Thu Jan 28, 2021 4:38 pm

man I have got to update this build

got it finished a few years ago

but it has a fuel delivery problem we cannot solve.

read this if you feel like it

maybe you guys will have a suggestion
( have this question in to the MONZA GURU Clyde Biagi also )

[b]run down on details:

1977 notchback
monza
factory 5.0
bone stock resto
no deviations from factory
new motor
new fuel lines
now on second brand new in tank fuel pump

ran fine during and after restoration

sat a few weeks
would not crank

runs if you pour gas into carb

no gas getting to carb

first time, we changed out the NOS ac/delco pump
with new carter pump, would not start

we blew air thru the metal line at charcoal canister,...
heard slosh in tank

then it cranked and ran fine
came back 5 days later, cranked and ran

next time, a week later
will not crank

will run if pouring gas into carb

this time
we took off oil pressure switch near distributor
bypassed it with a wire looped back into plug

it did not work

we cant hear elec pump running at all

we blew air thru line to tank again
it forced gas to flow out of line to carb

we hooked line back up
but once fuel was gone from forced ait, gas flow quit.

we wonder
is something starving the pump,.ruining it,.... or vapor locking it ?

got to be something simple

when i got car back to restore
the previous owner had rigged an elec pump outside of tank to push fuel to motor

did chevy have trouble with this set up
and was that done a lot over the years.....

grabbing at straws

any help appreciated.
[/b]
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby Monza Harry » Thu Jan 28, 2021 7:24 pm

Solsaks you stated a couple of times that it "would not crank" that typically means that the motor isn't turning over, if I am reading from context correctly, that you are meaning "Would Not Fire Up" I'm not trying to "split hairs" just trying to make sure we are talking about the same thing. My car is doing something incredibly similar if I read your situation correctly! I very much get your frustration!!!!! :evil: Where my friend and I got to when the weather changed to "Hibernation Season" here, we had set up the car with the tank out and a separate power supply to the pump and it seems to be ~working more predictably for now. My next step will be get inside and underhood and start tracing the fuel pump wiring and searching for corrosion/breaks/$#!+ etc. These pumps are very low power [I recall a 1 Amp fuse(?)] and I don't usually hear the pump when it is all in the car (I am also getting very "hard of hearing" now, but I wasn't always), I also don't remember ever hearing them back when I could hear, with out getting down on my hands and knees at the back of the car. I suggest adding a "Tee" at or near the pump for a voltage check [anything below battery voltage is suspect] it should all be 1/4" blade connectors [IIRC] at the tank sending/pump unit so no need to cut any wiring. Also check your grounds [tee the -ve side and check voltage to a known good ground anything above 0.05 volts isn't good should read @ or very near zero! Start with a 12V scale and reduce slowly on the ground side, better yet beg, borrow, or otherwise obtain an "Auto Ranging" meter. Check back with results and questions I check in at least 2-3 times a week I try for more. There are also a few other electrically gifted members here, seek them out if this doesn't mesh with your cars "ways". Also these pumps can be "a little finicky with alcohol added fuels", so try to run alcohol free fuels while troubleshooting, one F$%^&*g headache at a time is more than enough! Good luck and keep us posted! Harry
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby SOLSAKS » Fri Jan 29, 2021 3:20 pm

thanx Monza harry just saw your reply
thanx for the good info
sorry to hear you had same issues

CORRECT
IT WILL CRANK/TURN OVER BUT WILL NOT FIRE UP

I will take note of all you said
and report back with what we find

dave in NC USA :D
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby SOLSAKS » Fri Jan 29, 2021 3:22 pm

the last time it was running

Image
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby Monza Harry » Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:21 pm

10 Holes with good looking centers and White Letters! Damn now we're stylin'! I love that combo even though I'm more a hatch and spoilers kinda guy, any H-Body is a good H-Body, and that has a Good Look about it Dave And good I did read that correctly about the fuel situation, Thanx for sharing! Harry
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby SOLSAKS » Fri Jan 29, 2021 9:15 pm

thanx harry
driver side rims = restored, no clear coat, turned on a lathe type deal ( done at Detroit cvintage wheel )

he ruined one of my rims

so I had to find more,....

ran across 2 NOS

so driver side = reconditioned

passenger side = NOS

reconditioned rims have fine lines from turning them on lathe,...
NOS has mirror polished surface.....

all center caps are NOS

no-one would realize how hard it is to build a Monza, since they were not saved/collected as much and virtually no aftermarket to support restoration

there are some really rare parts on this tiny 4 lug gem....and it is very dangerous in the wrong hands ( when running ) due to handling issues.

dave:)
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby zeke » Sun Jan 31, 2021 7:48 am

"this time
we took off oil pressure switch near distributor
bypassed it with a wire looped back into plug

it did not work

we cant hear elec pump running at all"

With key in run position and pressure switch jumped from blue to pink, fuel pump should run. If it isn't, you're not getting power to the pump motor. Does pink wire at pressure switch have 12 volts with key on? Test pump fuse with an ohmmeter?

I'd drop the tank and check to make sure both power and ground are getting to the tank sender connector.

Circuit info here: viewtopic.php?f=44&t=45520
Chris

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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby SOLSAKS » Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:35 am

thanx zeke
hope to work on it again soon....

dave :D
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby 79MonzaSpyder » Mon Mar 15, 2021 5:44 pm

hey Dave, just checkin' in, any update on the Monza fuel supply issue? Did you get it running or is still not starting?
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby SOLSAKS » Tue May 24, 2022 4:33 pm

still got the same issue
I wish I was more mechanically gifted
I have to rely on others
I would take it to a shop
but there are none I know of who know how to treat a restored car, you know
without being ruff etc,.... ir none that are honest snuff to trust.

iw oddly love to get this thing running
so I could at least take in down the road every once in a while
since so much effort was out into every detail including mechanical and cosmetics

its now a 50 grand boat anchor......

I have a ton of Monza parts that I need to get off my butt and list here

thanx for all the replies.

dave in NC :D
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby monzaaddict » Fri May 27, 2022 7:30 am

You have 3 wires at the oil pressure sender. the purple wire goes from the starter solenoid and energizes fuel pump when starter is cranking. You can hook up one end of a test light to purple at oil pressure sender connector and other end to ground and light should illuminate when cranking. The pink wire on oil pressure sender is power from the ignition switch that energizes fuel pump when key is on and oil pressure is present. With the key on hook one end of test light to pink terminal in oil pressure sender connector and other end to ground and light should illuminate with key on. If it does, then put a jumper between the pink and blue wires on oil pressure sender and go back to the fuel pump connector. There are 3 wires on fuel pump connector. Black is ground, tan is for the gauge and blue or possibly another color is power to the pump. Hook the test light to the power wire and chassis ground and with pink/blue wires jumped at oil pressure connector and the ignition key on run, the light should illuminate. If you have a voltmeter you can check the voltage. Then check the pump ground by putting test light between power and ground terminal on fuel pump connector. If you have power to pump then your problem is likely with the sender. Pull the sender out of the tank. hook power and ground from battery to the pump terminals and see if pump runs. My guess is the wires that run from the terminals on top of fuel pump assembly to pump are not making good contact or corroded where they connect at the terminals. The wires are connected to the terminals by push nuts. If you try and pry them off the plastic insulators will likely break. cut the clips partially through with a die grinder and then break them off (while not damaging the terminals or insulators). If the insulation on the factory flat wire is falling off, peel it off and get some dr25 3/8 shrink tube. clean the terminals and get new push clips. (I have some from when I did mine). If the insulators break or if you want someone else to repair your sender. Jay Hovick on Facebook can help you out.
Last edited by monzaaddict on Fri May 27, 2022 6:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby monzaaddict » Fri May 27, 2022 7:51 am

i would use a spectra sp1256 fuel pump which auto zone shows in stock. Specrtra was started in late 80's. My feeling is the internal parts are more likely to be compatible with ethanol if pump happens to be old stock. The strainer is AUTOBEST F201S available on Rockauto. you might have to cut tab off end of pump so strainer fits properly or pump fits properly onto sending unit.
Last edited by monzaaddict on Sun May 29, 2022 8:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 1977 V8 Monza found after 18 years

Postby monzaaddict » Sun May 29, 2022 6:46 am

https://www.ebay.com/itm/190711330273?e ... xyg6BRzKs7

or just buy the multimeter. either or both will work. If you can restore a car, you can figure out the fuel pump wiring. It is not complicated.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/EverStart-Pr ... lsrc=aw.ds
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